"By His Stripes ye were healed" refers to spiritual healing? 1. The fact the Matthew translates and interprets the Isaiah passage as meaning physical healing kind of puts the kibosh to that proposal: Matthew 8:16-17 16 When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with [his] word, and healed all that were sick: 17 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare [our] sicknesses. 2. Quote: The apostle Paul couldn't heal Timothy's stomach problem (1 Timothy 5:23) nor could he heal Trophimus at Miletus (2 Timothy 4:20) or Epaphroditus (Philippians 2:25-27). First off... we do not know what Paul did in reference to these guys. Second off... That healing is provided for all in the atonement is not dependant on someone else's faith , it is dependant on you discerning the lord's body and appropriating it for yourself. I cannot believe for you for the salvation or the healing that is provided for us in the atonement. You have have to do this yourself. Of course healing can be achieved by faith in prayer and the gift of healing. But we are not talking about prayer or the gifts. We are talking about walking in the light of the word. 3. Quote: Paul spoke of a bodily illness he had (Galatians 4:13-15). I am sorry.... I do not see the words "bodily illness" in this passage. Perhaps you are using a paraphrase or an amplified version??? This is much discussed and can mean any number of things and does not have to included any sort of physcial sickness. The passage from 2 Cor 13 specifically states that the thing that afflicted him was a messenger from satan... not a physical sickness. You are commiting a common error in these examples. You are assuming the integrity of these men rather than the integrity of God. It is God's will that all be saved. "Salvation is part of the atonement". But not everyone is saved are they? Does that mean that salvation is not included in the atonement? No.... it certainly is. Just because men have not availed themselves of this benefit does not mean the benefit is not available to all who believe. It is. It is the same with healing. It is available to all who will believe. There are reasons why people do not/cannot believe. But just because men do not believe, that does not make God a liar. It is still true. In fact... 1 Corin 11 states that taking the Lord's supper without discerning the lord's body is heresy. ((1Co 11:19 For there must be also heresies among you...)) This is why many are sick, weak, and die young. If we would understand why Jesus suffered the stripes on His back and terrible suffering on the cross, then we would see that He in fact has taken our sicknesses and we would not be sick, weak, and die young. 1 Corinthians 11:29-30 29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. 30 For this cause many [are] weak and sickly among you, and many sleep. These verses have no meaning unless healing is provided for all in the atonement. If we discern the Lord's body- we have health, if we do not, we are subject to sickness. To refute the suffering of Jesus on behalf of our sickness is tantamount to treading the body of the Lord underfoot and counting His sacrifice and nothing. 4. Quote: Am I saying we shouldn't pray for healing? Of course not. But I am saying that after we've asked for healing, we need to submit to God's sovereign will, a view that “atonement-healing” does not allow much room for. Those who believe the Biblical teaching regarding healing are submitting to the soveriegn will of God. They just believe that He said yes. They are submitting to that yes. Healing being part of the atonement does not require prayer. We do not have to ask God to heal any more than we have to ask God to save. We just have to believe what He said and walk in the light of it. Quote: Atonement healing assumes it is ALWAYS (without question and without fail) God’s will to bring immediate and instant healing on demand. It cannot allow that God may actually have a purpose in allowing illness. Not on demand. On belief. Big difference. The use of the word "demand" makes it look like we are telling God what to do. We are not. We are just falling in line with His established will. What if we applied your concept to salvation. Does God delay and even deny salvation because there is "some purpose" in our damnation? Do have to wait on the will of God concerning our salvation, or do we just accept that His will is yes and amen? Of course we just accept His established will and go with it. 5. Quote: Plus, atonement-healing just does not work out in real life. Christians, even Christian leaders of the atonement-healing variety, are just as frequently sick as anyone else, wear glasses like everyone else, come down with the flu, suffer heart attacks, pneumonia, hypertension, gout, acne, and bad breath. . I am not sure you can prove that. I can only look at my own life and say that it has proven out for me. I have rarely been sick over the last 35 years, and never had any major illness. In the last 10 years I have seen a doctor once... and only because a job required a physical. The fact is, I quit praying about healing and health a long time ago just like I quit praying about salvation when I discovered it was a done deal. I now just strive to walk in the light of it. We do not have to ask for something that has already been given us. Holiness Christians sin just like everyone else... does that mean we should just give up walking in the light of what God says about holiness? Quote: Despite all this, because they are wed to a favored doctrine, they are closed to any other views, no matter how well based in scripture or confirmed in real life they may be I do not think you have representing the "healing in the atonement" believer very well here. You have pretty much pushed everything to the extreme and blown the entire concept beyond what even they present just so you could refute it. This topic is much more expansive that a simple yes or no. There are reasons why people do not/cannot avail themselves of this benefit just like there are reasons why people can not/no not avail themselves of salvatoin. That does not invalidate the reality of it. You seem to be mixing many different ingredients together here and coming up with a soup that looks and tastes terrible. I think you are an honest soul and would not do this intentionally to misrepresent our views... so I am forced to believe that you are confused about what we teach. I have to say, that from reading what you have written, you are not presenting the same "healing is provided for all in the atonement" that I have come to believe and that is taught in most churches.	PORN Death FIRE Logosystem